Thursday 11 January 2018

Fine Words from the North Wind

Someone called North Wind posted the following comments on my previous post. His insight and candour were so profound that I have reposted his comments in their entirety:

Great content and advice Rookh, I’m an int’l contractor and in the military before that, worked in dozens of countries, and years ago independently came to the same conclusions as you. The Anglosphere and its Stalinist family courts, divorce laws and alimony and child support slavery, based in puritanical Anglo culture and its cuck chivalry tradition combined with cultural Marxism, are uniquely disastrous for civilization and have made marriage and the family untenable in the English-speaking world. As you have, I’ve rejected the parallel but too often misguided claims of at least some corners of the MRA and MGTOW movements; sure they get some of the truth, but many draw incorrect or overgeneralized conclusions when they paint with broad brush and lambast “the West” instead of just “the Anglosphere” where the truly suicidal family law and divorce court practices are in place. It is still important for men to engage women and raise families, and civilization, including Western civilization, must be preserved.

But this must happen outside the Anglosphere, which is on a one-way course to civilizational suicide thanks to the madness of its misandry, crushingly oppressive marriage and divorce laws and the deeply rooted political correctness that makes it impossible to reform them. It isn’t just the indentured servitude and neo-slavery of unchecked child and spousal support obligations forced onto American and Anglosphere men. As we’re also seeing with the #metoo and #timesup media frenzy now, it’s the way Anglosphere Puritanism and dumb white knight chivalry give the most selfish, emotionally unstable women absolute power to ruin the livelihoods of productive men and businesses with inflated or wholly unfounded allegations. The solution is not complete disengagement from starting families or completely “leaving the West” as some MGTOW’s push for, it is ditching specifically the US or other Anglo countries to move to a place outside the Anglosphere and starting families there, especially in the European mainland and other parts of the non-Anglo West. Contrary to at least some MGTOW lore, which has been sadly polluted and distracted by the misinformed anti-Europeanism of neocon and even Breitbart style “conservatism”, 90% of the West is far more commonsensical and supportive of fathers and productive spouses than any of the suicidal nation-states of the Anglosphere. Not perfect, but reasonable enough that it’s worth it to be a father and start families there.

Yes, there is a good deal of foolish PC, feminism and maddening short-sighted policy and culture infecting the non-Anglosphere nations of the West, too. But the vulture-like and predatory style of divorce, the rent seeking and extreme high risk to men's finances, well being and very freedom, is unique to the Anglosphere and especially the United States and Canada, where destitution and prison terms face even high-earning divorced men. There’s a ton of good articles on why this is, and you’ve cited many of them. But the heart of it is the combination of legal precedent in Anglo common-law, plus lingering cultural precedents like Puritanism and the extreme cuck-ish nature of Anglo chivalry, have been absolutely toxic and suicidal for the Anglosphere when joined at the hip to feminism and cultural Marxism.

This is how and why even other Western countries with a lot of the same stupidity with feminism and cultural Marxism, like in Scandinavia, are in heavy contrast to the Anglosphere, surprisingly father-friendly and protective of the assets of a productive working man, forbidding alimony and being commonsensical with limited child support. They’re civil-law countries, and without the self-destructive cognitive dissonance of Anglo Puritanism and cuck chivalry, their social democracy systems and welfare states actually provide a much fairer and more rational environment for both spouses and children. These policies in the non-Anglosphere world remove the asinine profit incentive and high stakes profiteering in US family courts, not only reducing the divorce rate but making sure men don’t get “taken to the cleaners” in divorce as is routine in the US and Anglosphere.

Sweden stands out for this. Even with its own dumb forays into cultural Marxism, Sweden is one of the most pro-husband and pro-father countries in the Western world, with paternity leave, near forbidding of alimony in practice and none of this permanent spousal support BS like in the US. There’s also capped child support, tradition on shared custody and a requirement that any women initiating divorce have to go out and earn a living. Yes Sweden has feminism, but in the absence of Anglo cuck chivalry and Puritanism, divorcing women don’t get the “have your cake and eat it too” bullshit of the Anglosphere where they suddenly become needy dependents after divorce. In Sweden, the feminist credo of being an independent woman means what it sounds like, women after a divorce have to step up and work, without using the ex-husband as a meal-ticket. It’s similar or even better in the rest of Scandinavia, the Catholic countries of the Mediterranean and South America, the German and centrally European countries and especially eastern Europe.

In fact, my absolutely favorite places to get posted for contracts are in France and central and eastern Europe. The ladies there not only hot but sweet and chill about simply being sexy, even though they can be assertive and independent minded they don’t buy into the stupid misandry of the Anglosphere with its #metoo and “take the deadbeat Dad to the cleaners” mind-set. And they’re earnest about starting and maintaining families. Just look at the way Catharine Deneuve and other French women stood up and spoke out against the #metoo Salem witch hunt in the US and Britain recently, going so far as to write a major piece in the French Monde newspaper to support the importance of men being able to hit on women without getting tagged for harassment. This is what too many MGTOW’s and self-claimed “conservatives” don’t get when they blindly trash Sweden and lambast “the West” in general, it’s the Anglosphere, not the rest of the West, which has made both the process and aftermath of divorce so toxic for men or anyone who works and saves for a living, made marriage itself toxic and draining for men while making the workplace itself toxic for even the most innocent male to female interactions.

Some of these self-claimed conservatives will whine about how ditching the Anglosphere means the Muslims, Africans and Latinos will take over, but at this point it doesn’t matter, and it’s too late to stop it anyway. Anglo civilization has slit it’s own throat with this insane Puritanism and misandry. Winston Churchill was sadly deluded with all his triumphalism in the history of English speaking peoples, the civilization may have been sustainable back then before feminism and cultural Marxism infected the media and universities of the Anglosphere. But in combo with the cuck chivalry and Puritanism of the Anglo world, made worse by the profiteering of the common-law system, it means the ugliest decline and fall, and for the Anglo world it’ll be a lot worse than what the Romans saw. The birth rate and marriage rates of the Anglo populations in the Anglosphere keeps plunging farther and farther as the misandry of family courts and the overall culture continues to take it’s toll, so much so that Anglo families can survive only in the non-Anglo world now.

Nothing will save the Anglo countries in their current form. The coming demographic dispossession of the Anglosphere will be painful, probably means a lot of nasty civil wars and society upheavals in the near future. But the crisis and complete re-set may be the only thing to save at least a portion of the Anglosphere by forcing it to look squarely at the suicidal madness of what’s become Anglo culture.

How brilliant is that? I read Isaac Asimov's Foundation Trilogy recently, and it seems as much a prophetic vision of the contemporary Anglosphere - harrassed by imperial overstretch, intellectual decline, internal conflict and gynocentric consumerism - as it is a work of speculative fiction. As North Wind suggests, perhaps the time has come to salvage the most durable aspects of this ailing culture before it implodes completely.


  1. Couldn't have said it better, both you and North Wind get it! Forgive me for going on in detail myself but given the thought and intelligence you guys have put into your own insights here, I felt obligated to give an extended response myself.

    I'm one of the "exiles" from the failing and falling down Anglosphere, moved from the US to southwestern France over a decade ago and it's been a blessing in every dimension: career, love life, family, life quality, health, education, food. Everything. I was part of a big movement of Americans and Canadians who made our exit right around the start of the great Recession. The Silicon Valley press never had a precise name for us, but most of us made our fortunes in the software industry, saw writing on the wall and cashed in our stock options before the big crash of the S&P and Nasdaq in 2008.

    But after dodging one bullet, we were left pondering why we should risk everything again in the even more dangerous and unpredictable world of US divorce courts. Many of us had seen multimillionaire colleagues reduced to poverty and misery in US family courts after their wives sued for divorce. And slowly but surely we realized the problem was more than a few isolated cases or soothing marriage counselor platitudes. It was in the broader American, and more generally Anglophone culture itself. And in the brainlessness of the courts that give carte blanche to the most parasitic women to leech off their spouses who contribute to society. Around the same time we realized our skills were in demand internationally, and with Web design and software engineering jobs becoming portable thanks to remote platforms, it made sense for us to pack up and move. Most of us still wanted to start families and raise kids, but we realize we'd be putting our fortunes and hard work at risk by doing this in the US. Like you said, prenups don't give you any real protection in Ameican family courts. Only being out of the jurisdiction of these kangaroo courts entirely can do that.

    Our friends and colleagues who lost everything were typical of the hypocrisy that's infected all US family law. The men were "working too hard", you see, not enough time for the wife and kids even though the men's hard-earned paychecks were supporting these selfish bitches' ability to shop themselves silly and whine and moan in the first place! American and Anglo grown women with kids are still basically whiny little girls this way, they're never satisfied with their lot no matter how much their husbands slave away for them, even if they work 80 hour weeks in some struggling software company to give them a life of luxury. This is where the Anglosphere goes full stupid. Almost any other country would realize the wives complaints have no basis, that they're acting like spoiled brats and tell them to shove it. But US family courts thanks to feminism, the politically correct "mainstream media" and the collusion of moron white knight cucks, instead indulges this female infantilism from coddled, spoiled brat wives with no appreciation for things like hard work, sacrifice and patience.

  2. Thus the ongoing merry go round of inanity with "community property" awarded to wife too lazy to get off her own ass to work, on top of alimony, full custody and extortionate child support. If that wasn't retarded enough, now the #metoo bandwagon means the same spoiled brat women can pull the same kind of extortionate shit even with men who aren't their spouses in the US and rest of the Anglosphere. Just make a random accusation about made-up shit over a trivial "clumsy courtship" from 20 years ago and voila, a ruined man and a big payout for the attention-seeking whore. All fully encouraged by the Anglosphere and it's white knight cuck army. (Quebec is better but Anglo Canada is even worse, it's now so bad there that a defendant in sexual assault and misconduct cases can't even submit exonerating text messages to show their innocence!)

    I get why some men go MGTOW, if they're stuck in the Anglosphere that may be their only alternative. But far better is to do what their ancestors did but in reverse, leave the North American cultural swamp and migrate out of the country, head back to Europe outside the British Isles. In my case I married a sweet French girl and have 2 lovely daughters and a son. Even if things go sour I know I'll keep the heart of what I've earned, child support would be capped, I'd still support my kids but in a way that's reasonable and above all, is for the kids only, not an end-run to indulge the ex-wife's profligacy. The same goes for my fellow colleagues in France and around the continent, even the ones who brought their American or Canadian wives-and-girlfriends with them. It really is true, if you absolutely insist on marrying an Anglo girl, don't to it in an Anglo land!

    And best of all the chances of divorcing are a whole lot less since there aren't any lawyer leeches or judge vultures to profit from the divorce shitstorm like in the US. That's what the Napoleonic code and European law in general get you. And our family is stronger because of it. The French, Germans and most other Europeans are even cool with the open relationship and polyamory thing if that's your gig, and the families still do just fine. It's not our thing personally, but people are really about living and let live here. Another reason that the freedom from all the Anglo puritan horseshit is so refreshing.

    One last point, don't listen to the morons who babble on about how "France is going majority Muslim!" These idiots are either deluded or full of shit, this kind of propaganda comes from the Gatestone Institute and other neocon rags trying to push the US into more wars in the Middle East, and they're terrified they'll lose their tax base for war if more Americans wise up and say adios to the Anglosphere and its bullshit. The France of 2018 doesn't give a shit about its former colonial empire, the immigrants now come from the old eastern bloc and ironically from North America while the Muslims are being shown the door. Macron's turned out to be a sly political fox, he pretended to be centrist but on culture and demographics he's more hard core conservative than Le Pen could have ever dreamed of being herself, and he's using clever measures to throw out the Muslims. For him it's more a matter of business and attracting tourists and workers to France, but whatever the reason, it works. Oh, and the taxes? I pay much less taxes in France than California or New York, both of which I used to work in. The numbskulls among the reflexive conservatives love to cite the claimed high taxes to Euro-bash. But when you put all the different American taxes on the ledger, including Medi/Soc Security, Americans pay more but get a lot less. There is no sensible reason not to come here, especially if you want to start a family, which we indeed still can and should.

  3. Anglo Feminazis like Chanty Binx claim victimhood under the gender version of Marxism, but support ultra-Capitalist policies like a police state to protect mostly white upper class women. You never hear Chanty Binx complain about the plight of the poor and racialized Canadians and Americans, but focus on only white feminism and how to oppress everyone else's freedom of speech in the name of white feminist rhetoric.

  4. "I get why some men go MGTOW, if they're stuck in the Anglo-sphere that may be their only alternative. But far better is to do what their ancestors did but in reverse, leave the North American cultural swamp and migrate out of the country, head back to Europe outside the British Isles"

    It's getting worse for men to obtain residency and citizenship outside of their countries of birth and origin. With Trump promoting nationalism and causing an after-effect of Anti-American hatred, it will be extremely difficult for American (and to some extent Canadian) men to migrate to foreign countries unless he has family or connections to obtain citizenship.
    At least 400 men in Toronto alone die every year from suicide, but you rarely hear this from your local news who encourage millions of men to enter a vortex of hell Canadian catchphrase "Come to Canada". Married men should not Come to Canada because Hell is waiting for them as soon as they land at Toronto.

    1. Altho Europe may not be happy about Trump's nationalism much, the Europeans and Euro authorities still don't look down on Americans or Canadians as a whole, especially when they want to leave America and come to work in Europe. If anything the opposite, they see all the worsening turmoil in America as an opportunity to recruit mostly skilled, hard working and capable immigrants who tehmselves usually have European ancestry.

      I in fact help out with informal residency permit consultation for US and Canadian citizens looking to move to Scandinavia, Belgium and the Netherlands, and the big majority have had no trouble getting residency or citizenship, in the past year at least it's gotten easier. France for ex. is aggressively out recruiting skilled and trained Americans, Canadians and Brits to come there and paying them pretty well. Sweden where I currently work has a similar program as do the Netherlands and Belgium. Germany and Austria are also big supporters of the blue card program that brings in skilled workers. Even if your not super skilled, sign up for some classes, they let you work part time and save up, and you can use that as a bridge to pick up the language, always a huge plus and then find work to help settle down.

      Picking up at least some of the language is also a plus to help dispel all the bad information and fake news about Europe that's all over the US and UK, including in MSM outlets. Like the OP was saying Breitbart does tell a lot of un PC truth but they've got a serious blindspot on Europe. Both Breitbart and liberal mainstream media like CNN, Time Magazine, Guardian and NBC ran some completely made up story about how Sweden had passed a law requiring a formal signed written contract to have consent for sex. Because I'd learned Swedish I instantly knew this whole claim was absolute bullshyte, turned out there were a couple Swedish tabloids that put up salacious stories about a proposed law in December that was focussed on protections in the adult film and other industries. And it didn't even take the form of a law, just proposals and increased protections.

      So the US and British media completely mistranslated the story and then echoed each other to misreport it. This is "professional" journalism in the Anglo world for you, since most of their editors don't know Swedish or other languages they constantly report fake shyte about foreign countries. The Swedes maybe aren't quite as open about sexuality and frowning on the #me too crap as the French, Spaniards or Italians, but they and the other Scandinavians are practical people and mature about sex and sexual matters. All the more reason to learn the language here, it'll give you a leg up on coming here.

  5. Have to admit I'm taking a measure of perverse pleasure in the ludicrous extremes that the #metoo shitstorm is going with this Aziz Ansari mess. It's damn obvious that he had a bad date that didn't meet the girl's expectations, the kind of thing that happens to anyone and everyone at some point, from Joe Schmoe mechanic up to brad Pitt. And now because of this extreme stupidity and the blood stained minefield that Anglosphere dating has become, this blown out of proportion incident and the ones to come are going to single handedly bring down the Anglosphere. Destroy the Anglosphere, in fact, as in make it non-viable as a working society.

    For women, now no man can possibly go and be "woke" enough to read her mind and all her nonverbal signals, so now every single man on a date is a rapist in the making. Every. single. one.

    And of course now men are catching on to this utter no win situation in American dating and Anglosphere dating in general, and opting out. Completely. It is way to farking dangerous to even consider the madness of dating from now on. Ever.

    So we've reached the point now where girls and women in the Anglosphere are condemned to a future of becoming celibate cat ladies. While men in the Anglosphere will indeed have no option but to go MGTOW, unless of course they move out of it like you guys are recommending. Notable that now, even dating or casual association at the workplace or socially is becoming far too dangerous for men in the Anglosphere. Ironically this will at least spare men the hazard of getting married in the Anglosphere with the, more probable than not, divorce and bankrupting alimony and child support to follow.

    So the Anglosphere is officially dead. Or at least on its deathbed. The Anglosphere is collapsing before our eyes. Stick a fork in it. Good riddance.

    Any civilization so utterly dumb and self-destructive that it makes it impossible for men and women to have basic sexual relations and childbearing without a gazillion layers of bottled up social acrimony, mixed signals, mindreading and flaring resentments is too damn stupid, lame and pathetic to survive. You made some nice contributions to civilization at one point, Anglosphere, but now you've completely forfeited any right to survive with this absolute bullshit.

  6. You guys are right btw, the one solution for Anglosphere men at this point is taking off for distant shores and different cultures. Give me France any day with the majesty and nuance of a superhot bikini model like Laetitia Casta speaking out against the stupidity of this "movement", joined by her graceful, elegant sisters like Catherine Deneuve and the thousands of other French women who've called bullshit. Let's not jut talk about this here to our own choir, let's get onto other forums, Reddit and the chans, write letters to the editor or even newspaper and magazine articles- if you want to have a halfway normal love and working life these days, and real relationships as humans have had for millennia, you need to get out of the Anglosphere. There is no other way. This goes both for men and for the remaining sensible women in the Anglophere. Leave it. This is our era's "Go West, young man". We have to leave the civilizational shithole of the Anglosphere, there is no other way anymore.

    To you American c***s and Anglosphere losers in general, the French are showing us what real women, with class and confidence, have understood for eons courtship, love and mating are a dance, a delicate and often misunderstood dance of seduction, and any civilization depends on it for its own survival. The puritanical and Victorian fainting couch f---witness of the Anglosphere was a poison pill for the civilization for the beginning, that seems to have been activated into a death blow for the Anglo world when added to fourth wave feminism, neo-Leftism and the corporate "throw 'em under the bus" attitude of US and Anglosphere "money above people" corporations.

    Anglo fools at one point thought their civilization was superior to the French, Germans, Spaniards, Italians and Portuguese. But now with all the Anglo men (and halfway reasonable women) realizing they can find a sane society only in places like France, Germany, Portugal, Italy, Spain and South America and Asia, the Anglosphere is going to see a massive, increasing exodus of millions of its people, leaving only the non-reproducing dregs behind. No sympathy from me, the Anglosphere has slit its own throat.